The Geek Forum
Main Forums => Political Opinions => Topic started by: jimmi on August 16, 2008, 03:47:25 AM
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In case you haven't noticed.
http://jimmibaez.wordpress.com/2008/08/15/the-trouble-with-georgia/
To sum it up; Georgia wants land, someone else defends that land, Georgia refuses to give up.
Georgia calls upon us, we tell the president to gtfo.
Or that's the way I see it.
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Huh?
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Oh come on, Georgia bombed the fuck out of South Ossetia in the beginning. That's a fact and both Russia and Georgia recognize this fact.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8XI2Chc6uQ&feature=related
And from the following article;
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2008/aug2008/ruge-a09.shtml
Eduard Kokoity, the South Ossetian leader, estimated late Friday that more than 1,400 civilians had been killed in the Georgian military assault.
“I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars,” Lyudmila Ostayeva, 50, told the Associated Press after fleeing the city with her family to a village near the Russian border. “It’s impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged.”
So then here comes Russia; and indescriminately bombs the shit out of Georgia, South Ossetia,
and beyond; targeting military AND civillians.
Hahaha, what? You're saying that Russia thoughtlessly bombed Georgia and South Ossetia? Russia invaded South Ossetia to protect the civilians and to get to Georgia.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/08/09/georgia.ossetia/
They're primary target is [was, now because of the cease fire] Georgia.
Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov charged Georgia with utilizing massive violence with the aim of forcing the Ossetian population to flee. “We are receiving reports that a policy of ethnic cleansing was being conducted in villages in South Ossetia, the number of refugees is climbing, the panic is growing, people are trying to save their lives,” said Lavrov.
Fyi, I'm not trying to stir up some kind of debate consisting of internet shouting or anything. I'm just saying that I favour Russia at the moment.
On to your Texas argument, are you suggesting that if Texas were to decide to declare it's independance and ignore US sovereign law that either Mexico or the United States should invade it in attempt to regain control of it?
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Yeah you anti-American. Gtfo.
So you side with Georgia?
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Yeah you anti-American. Gtfo.
no u
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That's probably a bad example. Texas was it's own, independent nation before becoming part of the US, joined voluntarily, and the wording of the Texas Constitution strongly implies that it retains the option to do what it wants in the future, civil war (and state full of pussies) notwithstanding.
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no u
I owe you at least another +1 for that one. :-D
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Yeah you anti-American. Gtfo.
So you side with Georgia?
I followed the debate right up to that point. In what way does being pro-Georgia make you anti-American?
Nah, that's a great example. I can't think of another state with enough balls to even consider itself viable for independance.
I think the point he's making is that Texas has it written in their constitution to delcare independence whenever they want, whereas South Ossetian has no said pigeonhole to work with. Texas can say, "Well, we were agreeing to it the whole time, but now we're not, so fuck off." However South Ossetian doesn't have said luxury.
It would be more like if... well... Georgia suddenly decided it wasn't part of the United States anymore.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
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I followed the debate right up to that point. In what way does being pro-Georgia make you anti-American?
It doesn't I was joking, that's the reason I added the unnecessary 'gtfo'. Actually from what I've seen on the news it's the opposite of what I said if anything.
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I say we invade Texas to root out the separatists and taunt Mexico into counter invading so we'll have a pretext to push 'em back past the mescal line and build our fence there.
Then we set up a tequila pipeline, ending our dependence on foreign cactus juice.
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Brilliant!
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What's inconceivable to me is that Saakashvili didn't see this coming. Did he really expect Russia NOT to react? Did he really expect the US to send tanks and planes to the rescue? Did he really expect the UN (where Russia still has veto power in the security council) to do anything other than hem and haw?
If you want a US analogy, you need an alternate universe:
1. The Mexican American war of 1846 results not in the annexation of Texas, but an occupation of all of Mexico. For around 100 years, the US holds claim to Mexican territory, despite political and ethnic unrest everywhere south of Texas, and despite global approbrium.
2. After 100 years, the US loses its hold on Mexico. Texas is now part of Mexico again.
3. Texas makes a bid for sovereignty and takes a pro-US stand, pissing off Mexico City.
4. Mexico City announces its alliance with Russia, and makes a bid to enter into a military pact with Moscow, pissing off the US.
5. Mexico City starts bombing Texas.
What does the US do? Ignore it all? Or send in the cavalry?
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I second this idea for a tequila pipeline.
When do the invitations for the groundbreaking party go out? :-D
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What's inconceivable to me is that Saakashvili didn't see this coming. Did he really expect Russia NOT to react? Did he really expect the US to send tanks and planes to the rescue? Did he really expect the UN (where Russia still has veto power in the security council) to do anything other than hem and haw?
If you want a US analogy, you need an alternate universe:
1. The Mexican American war of 1846 results not in the annexation of Texas, but an occupation of all of Mexico. For around 100 years, the US holds claim to Mexican territory, despite political and ethnic unrest everywhere south of Texas, and despite global approbrium.
2. After 100 years, the US loses its hold on Mexico. Texas is now part of Mexico again.
3. Texas makes a bid for sovereignty and takes a pro-US stand, pissing off Mexico City.
4. Mexico City announces its alliance with Russia, and makes a bid to enter into a military pact with Moscow, pissing off the US.
5. Mexico City starts bombing Texas.
What does the US do? Ignore it all? Or send in the cavalry?
That's the best summary of this situation that I've seen yet. Well put, as usual.
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What's inconceivable to me is that Saakashvili didn't see this coming. Did he really expect Russia NOT to react? Did he really expect the US to send tanks and planes to the rescue? Did he really expect the UN (where Russia still has veto power in the security council) to do anything other than hem and haw?
If you want a US analogy, you need an alternate universe:
1. The Mexican American war of 1846 results not in the annexation of Texas, but an occupation of all of Mexico. For around 100 years, the US holds claim to Mexican territory, despite political and ethnic unrest everywhere south of Texas, and despite global approbrium.
2. After 100 years, the US loses its hold on Mexico. Texas is now part of Mexico again.
3. Texas makes a bid for sovereignty and takes a pro-US stand, pissing off Mexico City.
4. Mexico City announces its alliance with Russia, and makes a bid to enter into a military pact with Moscow, pissing off the US.
5. Mexico City starts bombing Texas.
What does the US do? Ignore it all? Or send in the cavalry?
Isn't bombing Texas always a good option ?
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Isn't bombing Texas always a good option ?
Let them go off an be their own country. Don't care.