Topic: Calling all Catholics (Read 10641 times)

Joe Sixpack · « **on:** March 19, 2009, 08:20:33 AM »

With apologies to actual Catholics, I realize it may be folly to search for any logic in an organization of this type. But what is the reasoning behind this eating of fish and avoidance of other meat, and on Fridays only? Isn't fish also meat? The meat of a fish? I saw a commercial for Taco Cabana where they were pitching shrimp quesadilla as a fish sammich substitute. Is shrimp cool? It's not a fish. So is it all seafood that's ok to eat on Friday? Lastly, hypothetically speaking, would one be able to eat a penguin? I'm not sure if it counts as seafood or "meat".
Discuss!

Socrates · « **Reply #1 on:** March 19, 2009, 08:55:31 AM »

I think it's a symbolic abstinence thing, I remember never being satisfied with the answers I got when I asked that as a kid but I like fish and seafood so I didn't mind being guaranteed to eat it once a week.

I did find this link
http://catholicism.about.com/od/catholicliving/p/Abstinence.htm

much longer and more detailed explanations here
http://www.catholic-forum.com/forums/printthread.php?t=311

xolik · « **Reply #2 on:** March 19, 2009, 09:20:50 AM »

Health reasons. It's the church's way of subtly encouraging people to get off of red meat every once in a while.

I'm not exactly Catholic, but I still try to eat fish on Friday if anything because salmon is yummy and a good source of protein. Plus if eating fish on a certain day scores heaven points, then so much the better.

You're right about not getting a 'logical' answer regarding questions about religious rituals. Most of the time, the default answer will be along the lines of "Because God said so" or something very long winded that takes up pages and pages of written material which ends with "and we do this all because God said so."

Example: "So, what's up with all the incense burning in church?"
"God likes it."
"How do you know?"
"He said so."
"You mean He spoke to you directly?"
"No."
"He told the Pope over the phone?"
"No."
"How do you know He likes it?"
"He said so in the Bible."
"Well how do you know He still likes it? Maybe He changed His mind."
"If He changed His mind, it would be in the Bible, or the Pope would tell us."
"So He DOES speak directly to the Pope?"
"No."
"GEE THANKS THAT CLEARS IT ALL UP! superstious simpleton..."
"Glad to help! smart ass pagan..."

Probie · « **Reply #3 on:** March 19, 2009, 09:33:04 AM »

Quote from: xolik on March 19, 2009, 09:20:50 AM

Health reasons. It's the church's way of subtly encouraging people to get off of red meat every once in a while.

I'm not exactly Catholic, but I still try to eat fish on Friday if anything because salmon is yummy and a good source of protein. Plus if eating fish on a certain day scores heaven points, then so much the better.

You're right about not getting a 'logical' answer regarding questions about religious rituals. Most of the time, the default answer will be along the lines of "Because God said so" or something very long winded that takes up pages and pages of written material which ends with "and we do this all because God said so."

Example: "So, what's up with all the incense burning in church?"
"God likes it."
"How do you know?"
"He said so."
"You mean He spoke to you directly?"
"No."
"He told the Pope over the phone?"
"No."
"How do you know He likes it?"
"He said so in the Bible."
"Well how do you know He still likes it? Maybe He changed His mind."
"If He changed His mind, it would be in the Bible, or the Pope would tell us."
"So He DOES speak directly to the Pope?"
"No."
"GEE THANKS THAT CLEARS IT ALL UP! superstious simpleton..."
"Glad to help! smart ass pagan..."

my eyes are watering from laughing so hard.

Joe Sixpack · « **Reply #4 on:** March 19, 2009, 09:33:41 AM »

Quote

This morning there was a knock at my door. When I answered the door I found a well groomed, nicely dressed couple. The man spoke first:
John: "Hi! I'm John, and this is Mary."
Mary: "Hi! We're here to invite you to come kiss Hank's ass with us."
Me: "Pardon me?! What are you talking about? Who's Hank, and why would I want to kiss His ass?"
John: "If you kiss Hank's ass, He'll give you a million dollars; and if you don't, He'll kick the shit out of you."
Me: "What? Is this some sort of bizarre mob shake-down?"
John: "Hank is a billionaire philanthropist. Hank built this town. Hank owns this town. He can do whatever He wants, and what He wants is to give you a million dollars, but He can't until you kiss His ass."
Me: "That doesn't make any sense. Why..."
Mary: "Who are you to question Hank's gift? Don't you want a million dollars? Isn't it worth a little kiss on the ass?"
Me: "Well maybe, if it's legit, but..."
John: "Then come kiss Hank's ass with us."
Me: "Do you kiss Hank's ass often?"
Mary: "Oh yes, all the time..."
Me: "And has He given you a million dollars?"
John: "Well no. You don't actually get the money until you leave town."
Me: "So why don't you just leave town now?"
Mary: "You can't leave until Hank tells you to, or you don't get the money, and He kicks the shit out of you."
Me: "Do you know anyone who kissed Hank's ass, left town, and got the million dollars?"
John: "My mother kissed Hank's ass for years. She left town last year, and I'm sure she got the money."
Me: "Haven't you talked to her since then?"
John: "Of course not, Hank doesn't allow it."
Me: "So what makes you think He'll actually give you the money if you've never talked to anyone who got the money?"
Mary: "Well, He gives you a little bit before you leave. Maybe you'll get a raise, maybe you'll win a small lotto, maybe you'll just find a twenty-dollar bill on the street."
Me: "What's that got to do with Hank?"
John: "Hank has certain 'connections.'"
Me: "I'm sorry, but this sounds like some sort of bizarre con game."
John: "But it's a million dollars, can you really take the chance? And remember, if you don't kiss Hank's ass He'll kick the shit out of you."
Me: "Maybe if I could see Hank, talk to Him, get the details straight from Him..."
Mary: "No one sees Hank, no one talks to Hank."
Me: "Then how do you kiss His ass?"
John: "Sometimes we just blow Him a kiss, and think of His ass. Other times we kiss Karl's ass, and he passes it on."
Me: "Who's Karl?"
Mary: "A friend of ours. He's the one who taught us all about kissing Hank's ass. All we had to do was take him out to dinner a few times."
Me: "And you just took his word for it when he said there was a Hank, that Hank wanted you to kiss His ass, and that Hank would reward you?"
John: "Oh no! Karl has a letter he got from Hank years ago explaining the whole thing. Here's a copy; see for yourself."
From the Desk of Karl
1. Kiss Hank's ass and He'll give you a million dollars when you leave town.
2. Use alcohol in moderation.
3. Kick the shit out of people who aren't like you.
4. Eat right.
5. Hank dictated this list Himself.
6. The moon is made of green cheese.
7. Everything Hank says is right.
8. Wash your hands after going to the bathroom.
9. Don't use alcohol.
10. Eat your wieners on buns, no condiments.
11. Kiss Hank's ass or He'll kick the shit out of you.
Me: "This appears to be written on Karl's letterhead."
Mary: "Hank didn't have any paper."
Me: "I have a hunch that if we checked we'd find this is Karl's handwriting."
John: "Of course, Hank dictated it."
Me: "I thought you said no one gets to see Hank?"
Mary: "Not now, but years ago He would talk to some people."
Me: "I thought you said He was a philanthropist. What sort of philanthropist kicks the shit out of people just because they're different?"
Mary: "It's what Hank wants, and Hank's always right."
Me: "How do you figure that?"
Mary: "Item 7 says 'Everything Hank says is right.' That's good enough for me!"
Me: "Maybe your friend Karl just made the whole thing up."
John: "No way! Item 5 says 'Hank dictated this list himself.' Besides, item 2 says 'Use alcohol in moderation,' Item 4 says 'Eat right,' and item 8 says 'Wash your hands after going to the bathroom.' Everyone knows those things are right, so the rest must be true, too."
Me: "But 9 says 'Don't use alcohol.' which doesn't quite go with item 2, and 6 says 'The moon is made of green cheese,' which is just plain wrong."
John: "There's no contradiction between 9 and 2, 9 just clarifies 2. As far as 6 goes, you've never been to the moon, so you can't say for sure."
Me: "Scientists have pretty firmly established that the moon is made of rock..."
Mary: "But they don't know if the rock came from the Earth, or from out of space, so it could just as easily be green cheese."
Me: "I'm not really an expert, but I think the theory that the Moon was somehow 'captured' by the Earth has been discounted*. Besides, not knowing where the rock came from doesn't make it cheese."
John: "Ha! You just admitted that scientists make mistakes, but we know Hank is always right!"
Me: "We do?"
Mary: "Of course we do, Item 7 says so."
Me: "You're saying Hank's always right because the list says so, the list is right because Hank dictated it, and we know that Hank dictated it because the list says so. That's circular logic, no different than saying 'Hank's right because He says He's right.'"
John: "Now you're getting it! It's so rewarding to see someone come around to Hank's way of thinking."
Me: "But...oh, never mind. What's the deal with wieners?"
Mary: She blushes.
John: "Wieners, in buns, no condiments. It's Hank's way. Anything else is wrong."
Me: "What if I don't have a bun?"
John: "No bun, no wiener. A wiener without a bun is wrong."
Me: "No relish? No Mustard?"
Mary: She looks positively stricken.
John: He's shouting. "There's no need for such language! Condiments of any kind are wrong!"
Me: "So a big pile of sauerkraut with some wieners chopped up in it would be out of the question?"
Mary: Sticks her fingers in her ears."I am not listening to this. La la la, la la, la la la."
John: "That's disgusting. Only some sort of evil deviant would eat that..."
Me: "It's good! I eat it all the time."
Mary: She faints.
John: He catches Mary. "Well, if I'd known you were one of those I wouldn't have wasted my time. When Hank kicks the shit out of you I'll be there, counting my money and laughing. I'll kiss Hank's ass for you, you bunless cut-wienered kraut-eater."
With this, John dragged Mary to their waiting car, and sped off.

reimero · « **Reply #5 on:** March 19, 2009, 09:59:25 AM »

Quote from: Joe Sixpack on March 19, 2009, 08:20:33 AM

With apologies to actual Catholics, I realize it may be folly to search for any logic in an organization of this type. But what is the reasoning behind this eating of fish and avoidance of other meat, and on Fridays only? Isn't fish also meat? The meat of a fish? I saw a commercial for Taco Cabana where they were pitching shrimp quesadilla as a fish sammich substitute. Is shrimp cool? It's not a fish. So is it all seafood that's ok to eat on Friday? Lastly, hypothetically speaking, would one be able to eat a penguin? I'm not sure if it counts as seafood or "meat".
Discuss!

Actual Catholic here. Srsly.

The avoidance of meat on Fridays goes back to the middle ages (and before), when meat was a luxury only the rich could generally afford, whereas fish was much more commonly available. The idea was for people to give up something nice (like meat) as a form of penance and humility. The actual rules vary from diocese to diocese. In the U.S., fish is allowed. In the other places, fish and chicken are allowed (as poultry is not considered "meat" in some places.) Generally, any seafood constitutes "fish", but waterfowl do not.

The reason for Fridays is that Jesus is said to have died on a Friday. Catholics like symbolism.

Catholicism is highly ritualized, but those rituals have actual symbolic meaning rooted in tradition, dogma and/or the Bible.

Joe Sixpack · « **Reply #6 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:00:53 AM »

Makes sense. Why do you do it today then?

reimero · « **Reply #7 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:11:21 AM »

Quote from: Joe Sixpack on March 19, 2009, 10:00:53 AM

Makes sense. Why do you do it today then?

Part of it is symbolic. Any more, the abstinence from meat is still encouraged on Fridays, but only really enforced during Lent, and even then, there are all sorts of exceptions (for instance, if you are invited to another person's home and cannot reasonably refuse, and that person serves meat, you can eat it. And if you happen to forget, you're not going to hell for it.)

Really, more than anything it's a reminder about doing away with excess.

HeavyJay · « **Reply #8 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:16:06 AM »

I grew up in north Jersey...the Indian kids and I were pretty much the only non-Catholics at the grammar school I went to. The meat thing always confused me.

Also, around first grade:

Me: You've got some dirt on your forehead.
Teacher: Ugh, it's Ash Wednesday.

And that was all the explanation I got.

jeee · « **Reply #9 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:23:31 AM »

No meat and no condoms. "Thank god it's friday" is not for the Catholics then.

Wunderkind · « **Reply #10 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:39:29 AM »

Quote from: Joe Sixpack on March 19, 2009, 09:33:41 AM

*pure awesomeness*

The really scary thing is, I know people like Mary and John and they really do sound like that and they would really be offended by that and see no humor in it all, because Hank would kick the shit out of them for laughing at it.

xolik · « **Reply #11 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:50:21 AM »

On a somewhat related note, among the things I gave up for Lent was eating beef. No more burgers or steaks or other such goodness, just chicken, pork and fish. I've noticed a few things:

I have more energy
I don't really miss it as much as I thought I would
Intestinal fortitude has improved dramatically.

I think this may become a permanent thing.

One of the other things I gave up was playing my main in WoW which has everything to do with Lent and nothing at all with being gang-telled the minute I log on to heal heroics. Seriously, fuck you guys. Dalaran hasn't even fully rendered yet and I'm hearing three or for tell sounds already.

Probie · « **Reply #12 on:** March 19, 2009, 10:55:33 AM »

I don't eat a lot of steak; maybe once a month at most. It's tastey good, I would never give it up for good.

Joe Sixpack · « **Reply #13 on:** March 19, 2009, 11:20:02 AM »

I gave up church for lent.

Probie · « **Reply #14 on:** March 19, 2009, 11:23:55 AM »

Mum: What are you giving up for lent this yeah Nic?

Me: God mum, I'm giving up god.

xolik · « **Reply #15 on:** March 19, 2009, 12:31:35 PM »

Quote from: Probie on March 19, 2009, 11:23:55 AM

Mum: What are you giving up for lent this yeah Nic?

Me: God mum, I'm giving up god.

Did you get the "But He's not giving up on YOU" response? I've heard that one used a few times.

ivan · « **Reply #16 on:** March 19, 2009, 12:36:58 PM »

Quote from: xolik on March 19, 2009, 12:31:35 PM

Did you get the "But He's not giving up on YOU" response? I've heard that one used a few times.

By Catholics?

xolik · « **Reply #17 on:** March 19, 2009, 12:50:52 PM »

Quote from: ivan on March 19, 2009, 12:36:58 PM

By Catholics?

Not sure what they were. Maybe. Probably. Hell, I don't know, what is this, the freaking Inquisition?

Demosthenes · « **Reply #18 on:** March 19, 2009, 01:04:37 PM »

I'll bet you weren't expecting that, were you?

Because, well... you know.

Joe Sixpack · « **Reply #19 on:** March 19, 2009, 01:07:56 PM »

I was sitting
In a temple
I was minding
My own business
I was listening
To a lovely Hebrew mass

Then these papus
Persons plunge in
And they throw me in a
Dungeon, and they shove
A red hot poker up my ass...

Is that considerate?
Is that polite?
And not a tube
Of Preparation H in sight

xolik · « **Reply #20 on:** March 19, 2009, 01:07:56 PM »

The Inquisition, let's begin
The Inquisition, look out sin
We have a mission to convert the Jews (Jew ja Jew ja Jew ja Jews)
We're gonna teach them wrong from right
We're gonna help them see the light
And make an offer that they can't refuse (that the Jews just can't

refuse)

Confess (confess, confess)
Don't be boring
Say yes (say yes, say yes)
Don't be dull

A fact
you're ignoring:
it's better to lose your skullcap than your skull

The Inquistion, what a show
The Inquisition, here we go
We know you're wishing
That we'd go away
But the Inquisition's here and it's here to stay
The Inquisition, oh boy
The Inquisition, what a joy
The Inquisition, oy oy

I was sitting in a temple
I was minding my own business
I was listening to a lovely Hebrew mass
Then these papus persons plunge in, and they throw me in a

dungeon, and they shove a red hot poker up my ass

Is that considerate?
Is that polite?
And not a tube of Preparation H in sight

I'm sitting, plicking chickens and I'm looking through the pickings

and suddenly these guys bring down my balls
I didn't even know them and they grabbed me by the scrotum and

they started playing ping pong with my balls

Oy, the agony
Ooh, the shame
To make my privates public for a game

The Inquisition, what a show
The Inquisition, here we go
We know you're wishing
That we'd go away
But the Inquisition's here and it's here to -

- Hey, Torquemada, whaddaya say?
I just got back from the auto-da-fé
Auto-da-fé, what's an auto-da-fé?
It's what you oughtn't to do but you do anyway

Skit skat voodely vat tootin de day

Will you convert?
No, no, no, no
Will you confess?
No, no, no, no
Will you revert?
No, no, no, no
Will you say yes?
No, no, no, no

Now I ask in a nice way, I said pretty please, I bent their ears,

now I'll work on their knees!

Hey, Torquemada, walk this way
We got a little game that you might wanna play
So pull that handle, try your luck
Who knows, Torq, you might win a buck!
Alright!

Put it in the car (in the car x2)

How we doing? Any converts today?
Not a one, nay, nay, nay
We've flattened their fingers
We branded their buns
Nothing is working
Send in the nuns!

The Inquisition, what a show
The Inquisition, here we go
We know you're wishing
That we'd go away
So, c'mon you Moslems and you Jews
We got big news for all of yous
You better change your point of views today
'Cause the Inquistion's here and it's here to stay

ivan · « **Reply #21 on:** March 19, 2009, 01:24:44 PM »

Quote from: xolik on March 19, 2009, 12:50:52 PM

Hell, I don't know, what is this, the freaking Inquisition?

That is SO Vatican I.

xolik · « **Reply #22 on:** March 19, 2009, 02:28:48 PM »

Quote from: ivan on March 19, 2009, 01:24:44 PM

That is SO Vatican I.

True. Today it would be more like Inquisition 2: Electric (charges across your testicles)Boogaloo.

Demosthenes · « **Reply #23 on:** March 19, 2009, 02:31:31 PM »

Followed by "Inquisition III: The Search For Spock"?

xolik · « **Reply #24 on:** March 19, 2009, 02:50:20 PM »

Quote from: Demosthenes on March 19, 2009, 02:31:31 PM

Followed by "Inquisition III: The Search For the Holy Spook"?

FTFY

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Author Topic: Calling all Catholics (Read 10641 times)