Topic: Can I dis Michael Moore in here? (Read 9634 times)

reimero · « **on:** June 28, 2004, 03:52:16 PM »

I haven't seen Farenheit 9/11, nor do I intend to, but this guy rubs me the wrong way. I watch his sensationalist piece of garbage (aka a "documentary") "Bowling for Columbine" and was both disturbed and disgusted by his conclusions and his lack of insight.

Now I'm bothered by the fact that he's claiming this new movie has nothing to do with getting Kerry elected. Truth is, he's registered as a Democrat in New York, and registered to vote in Michigan. (That's right: he's legally registered to vote in 2 states. I'm not sure that's entirely legal.) He's also actively pushing people to vote Democrat and get their friends to vote Democrat.

I don't have a problem with partisan politics. I do have a problem selling hyperbole as fact and in misrepresenting yourself as what you're not: he claims to be an independent filmmaker who is concerned about the direction of the country. He is, in fact, a registered and card-carrying Democrat.[/code]

Demosthenes · « **Reply #1 on:** June 28, 2004, 04:44:24 PM »

Quote from: reimero

I don't have a problem with partisan politics. I do have a problem selling hyperbole as fact and in misrepresenting yourself as what you're not: he claims to be an independent filmmaker who is concerned about the direction of the country. He is, in fact, a registered and card-carrying Democrat.[/code]

I don't think he's misrepresenting himself. He hasn't made any secret of his own politics; in fact, I just read something this morning that quoted him as saying something to the effect of him wanting to send the Republican party leadership a thankyou card, because without them, his film wouldn't be doing as well as it has been.

That said, I'm not a fan of his politics, not being a Democrat, myself. Personally, I think his naked loathing of Republicans is just that... naked loathing. I don't think he's trying to disguise that as anything other than what it is.

I think he probably could have called "Fahrenheit 9/11" something else... perhaps, "Preaching To The Choir", since probably the vast majority of the viewership is going to be comprised of folks that are nodding their heads at him to begin with. He won't be gaining any real converts with this film. But those that agree with him will probably love it.

I have no plans to cough up any dough to see it on the big screen, though if a DVD is released I'll probably give it a rent to see what the hubbub is about.

reimero · « **Reply #2 on:** June 28, 2004, 04:51:01 PM »

I wouldn't rent it, either. I'm sure one of the major networks will run it at some point. But I couldn't stomach his Bowling for Columbine, I really don't think I'll like this one any better.

Demosthenes · « **Reply #3 on:** June 28, 2004, 04:52:57 PM »

Yeah, I wasn't too crazy about Bowling For Columbine, either.

hackess · « **Reply #4 on:** June 28, 2004, 04:54:34 PM »

A cow-worker saw it this past weekend; he said it's gruesome in bits, comedic in others, and entirely propagandic. I brought up the same point you just did, Demo; the majority of the people who are going to watch it are those who already agree with his particular flavor of politics. Those on the bubble aren't going to watch it, but their friends might.

Demosthenes · « **Reply #5 on:** June 28, 2004, 04:57:48 PM »

It's kind of like if a major motion picture is ever made of "Atlas Shrugged". About the only people that will really be interested in seeing it will be Randites, and maybe a few curious about it, but that'll be about it. Not exactly anything that will cause someone to have an earth-shattering paradigm shift and suddenly bring about a full top-to-bottom change in their world view or political opinion.

xolik · « **Reply #6 on:** June 28, 2004, 05:18:50 PM »

I cannot think of a single thing to say about Michael Moore that would be positive. Actually, I take that back. The man knows which side his bread is buttered on and makes no bones about it. That's kind of positive...

phyre · « **Reply #7 on:** June 28, 2004, 06:36:28 PM »

pbsaurus · « **Reply #8 on:** June 28, 2004, 06:41:43 PM »

I'm looking forward to seeing the flick.

xolik · « **Reply #9 on:** June 28, 2004, 06:45:04 PM »

Quote from: phyre

Um.

That's about $5.50 more than I would have paid.

phyre · « **Reply #10 on:** June 28, 2004, 06:46:08 PM »

My girl will probably pay more. And she's driving over 40 miles to see it.

Min · « **Reply #11 on:** June 28, 2004, 07:15:06 PM »

I like that theater.

xolik · « **Reply #12 on:** June 28, 2004, 07:23:11 PM »

I'd pay more if the popcorn is good there. With lots of butter....and salt! Oh, and reaaaaaaaalllllly syrupy soda.

MISTER MASSACRE · « **Reply #13 on:** June 28, 2004, 09:58:00 PM »

I recognize Michael Moore as an idealogical necessity.

I find him preachy and histrionic, but I realize these are both important to properly communicate his message.

From what I've read, it would seem that most of the anti-Republican sentiment in the movie can be found in the pure, unedited footage of their various gaffes. Hence, it's not really propaganda, but rather an indictment of people based on the VIDEO EVIDENCE of the stupid things they've done.

I, however, will wait UNTIL I'VE SEEN THE MOVIE to criticize it.

Dork.

Edit: Upon re-reading the initial post, I notice that your comment is directed more at Moore (oh ho) himself, rather than his work. Therefore, I retract -

Quote

I, however, will wait UNTIL I'VE SEEN THE MOVIE to criticize it.

Dork.

- and replace it with:

I, however, will wait UNTIL I'VE SLEPT WITH MICHAEL MOORE to criticize 'it'.

Wang^^.

Binoboy · « **Reply #14 on:** June 29, 2004, 12:14:42 AM »

Fox News liked it.
I officially have no reason to not see it now...

EDIT: To say something of more substance, Demo, I think you analogy to a movie version of Atlas Shrugged is a bit off. You forget the volumes of people going to see Fahrenheit 9/11 just to seethe and fume at the screen and curse Moore's name afterwards; naturally it's #1 at the box office now. Ayn Rand never had that kind of following.

The_FOO · « **Reply #15 on:** June 29, 2004, 05:35:45 PM »

*coughs*Bit Torrent*coughs*

Of course the nearest theatre to me that's showing it is over 3 hours drive away.

xolik · « **Reply #16 on:** June 29, 2004, 06:27:10 PM »

Quote from: The_FOO

*coughs*Bit Torrent*coughs*

Of course the nearest theatre to me that's showing it is over 3 hours drive away.

But movie piracry is wrong and you could wind up in prison.

Like the time I fell asleep in the forest and woke up in jail. How the hell did that happen?!? I fell asleep for five freaking hours and they somehow manage to build an entire jail around me.

Binoboy · « **Reply #17 on:** June 29, 2004, 07:31:44 PM »

But if you dislike the filmmaker's point-of-view, it's morally correct and completely legal to download it illegally.

The_FOO · « **Reply #18 on:** June 29, 2004, 07:38:30 PM »

File Sharing is legal in Canada.

Well, not really, but that's what I'm going with.

Demosthenes · « **Reply #19 on:** June 30, 2004, 08:08:43 AM »

Quote from: Binoboy

Fox News liked it.
I officially have no reason to not see it now...

EDIT: To say something of more substance, Demo, I think you analogy to a movie version of Atlas Shrugged is a bit off. You forget the volumes of people going to see Fahrenheit 9/11 just to seethe and fume at the screen and curse Moore's name afterwards; naturally it's #1 at the box office now. Ayn Rand never had that kind of following.

I didn't intend that analogy to mean that nobody would go see "Fahrenheit 9/11" out of pure vitriol alone. Of that I have no doubt.

I'm just saying that nobody is going to be seeing it to have their mind changed, that's all.

Vegetarian · « **Reply #20 on:** June 30, 2004, 11:10:41 AM »

I don't know much about him, but I liked Bowling for Columbine. I love the part about Canadian news ("Breaking news: New speedbumps!"), and the bit about open doors in TO.

Anonymous · « **Reply #21 on:** July 04, 2004, 06:52:09 PM »

Link

Quote

Controversial film-maker Michael Moore has welcomed the appearance on the internet of pirated copies of his anti-Bush documentary Fahrenheit 9/11 and claimed he is happy for anybody to download it free of charge.

The activist, author and director told the Sunday Herald that, as long as pirated copies of his film were not being sold, he had no problem with it being downloaded.

?I don?t agree with the copyright laws and I don?t have a problem with people downloading the movie and sharing it with people as long as they?re not trying to make a profit off my labour. I would oppose that,? he said.

?I do well enough already and I made this film because I want the world, to change. The more people who see it the better, so I?m happy this is happening.?

Moore?s views have not been well received by Hollywood?s establishment, which is fighting a war against the online pirates it claims cost the industry £1.6 billion a year in lost sales.

Jack Valenti, the outgoing president of the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA), said: ?We are proud that American films continue to enjoy immense popularity around the world but the need for copyright protection in the digital age is crucial to the preservation of our most prized trade asset.

?Piracy is having a dramatic impact on the creators and copyright owners of this nation, and its defeat depends largely on the commit ment and resolve of the entire industry.

?File sharing causes tremendous financial loss to the movie business, untold hardship to support workers, and costs thousands of jobs.?

Distributed via websites such as suprnova.org, which lays claim to having served more than 17 million downloads, Moore?s documentary critique of the Bush administration?s red, white and blue rush into war with Iraq is among the web?s hottest properties.

Thousands of copies of Fahrenheit 9/11 have already been downloaded, each taking about 3.5 hours over a broadband connection.

Ironically, the burgeoning underground market for Moore?s much-debated documentary has been championed by both sides of the political divide. While left-wing sites promote the film?s message, opponents of the high-profile polemicist are urging people to ?steal? their copy, thus denying its director his cut of the profits.

Last month the website of producers Lions Gate Films was subjected to a barrage of attacks by hackers, with one creating a link to a download destination on the site?s front page.

Despite up to 150 people simultaneously bagging free copies of its most valuable property at any given time 24 hours a day, Lions Gate says it has no plans to oppose the practice. While unwilling to make any official statement likely to further provoke Hollywood?s heavy hitters, the film company appears to have fallen into line with its director?s laissez-faire approach.

Moore said: ?Is it wrong for someone who?s bought a film on DVD to let a friend watch it for free? Of course it?s not. It never has been and never will be. I think information, art and ideas should be shared.?

Defenders of Moore?s position include Pulp Fiction director Quentin Tarantino, who earlier this year encouraged audiences in countries where his films are not legally available to obtain counterfeit copies.

The furore engulfing Moore is just the latest in a series of controversies surrounding the film. Almost smothered by original production company Miramax?s refusal to distribute the final cut, he also this year launched an unsuccessful legal attempt to overturn the MPAA?s decision to give the documentary an ?R? rating, which barred under-16s from seeing the movie without an adult.

Opposed by Move America Forward, a conservative group set up to dissuade cinemas from showing the film, Fahrenheit 9/11 has become one of the most controversial productions in Hollywood history. Last month Australian distributors Hopscotch Films claimed to have received e-mails warning that if the company went ahead with its planned release of the movie, it would do so ?at our own peril?.

The hubbub is unlikely to subside any time soon. With Lions Gate reporting that DVD rights are likely to be won by Disney-owned Buena Vista Home Entertainment, many commentators believe the digital distribution network may yet face serious opposition.

Valenti said: ?Nobody can allow their rights to be stolen because, if you can?t retrieve your investment, you?re out of the movie business,

?I don?t think there?s really a single actor or director in the world who does not believe that if you don?t combat piracy, it will devour you in the future.?

You see, he's not so bad at all. He has some sense.

The_FOO · « **Reply #22 on:** July 04, 2004, 08:31:03 PM »

W00t! I knew I liked him for more than Canadian Bacon.

pbsaurus · « **Reply #23 on:** July 06, 2004, 01:05:14 PM »

Saw the flick yesterday. I enjoyed it. I especially enjoyed the timing of his appropriately placed songs, and the scene of him harranguing congressmen with the Marine recruiter.

Not much new information was gleaned though.

Binoboy · « **Reply #24 on:** July 06, 2004, 06:20:26 PM »

You underestimate the American public, pb, my man. For us "informed" (read: angry) Americans, there was no new information gleaned. For the average viewer... well... they probably don't believe it anyway....

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Author Topic: Can I dis Michael Moore in here? (Read 9634 times)

Anonymous